Others have suggested Deadlock and that really sounds like the perfect game for you two, but be aware of one thing: it does require shooting. In the laning phase last hitting and securing the orbs from creep kills by shooting them is absolutely crucial, as the game will snowball out of control if one team outfarms the other.

There wasn’t when I played but it might have been added in a patch.

As I recall there are two decisions. First you get the choice of the Astral Tadpole, which opens the outer ring of mindflayer powers and gives you black veins in your face and the status “half-Illithid”.

Later - as part of the ending - you can decide to become a full on mindflayer, because for some arbitrary narrative reason the mcguffin can only be operated by one.

Yeah but even that is pointless because there are literally zero consequences to accepting the Astral Tadpole! Even though you’re half Illithid supposedly it all kinda just goes away in the happy ending. I don’t get it.

I don’t know if it’s been culled by now in patches, but when I played there were still lines by the narrator talking about the consequences and “if you do this, there’s no going back” regarding the brain worms. All lies, it turns out.

I have no clue why they cut it, but having it actually impact your potential choices and your endings would be thematically appropriate and make for fun and difficult gameplay choices, I would have thought.

The lack of consequences for the brain worms - and lack of rewards or even mentions for abstaining! - was part of why Act 3 soured me on the game quite a bit. Come on, not even a silly achievement for not using any Illithid power all playthrough?

I believe it. There was a steamcommunity post last year detailing all the cut content. I believe some of it has been added back through the patches (I only played through the game once, around launch).

To me the tadpole consequences is the most egregious, as the whole system and decisions connected to it feel so hollow when they end up not mattering at all.

My first thought as well.

I’ll wait for some more performance reviews and maybe even a few patches, but this sounds promising. Was looking forward to this game so I’m glad it seems like it delivers.

As someone who hadn’t even heard about Monday Night Combat until you brought it up, I’d love your take on how they compare after you’ve gotten some games in. Looking it up they do seem to have overlaps.

I never played it so couldn’t tell you, but if you want to try out and tell me how it compares I can toss you an invite.

I never played HotS but I played Dota 1&2 for many years. Recalibrating for Deadlock hasn’t been easy, despite being familiar with stuff like last hitting.

The farm thing is what stands out to me most, as you can’t really play passively if you feel like you’re outmatched skill-wise in Deadlock. In something like TF2 or Overwatch you can play more defensively if you feel disadvantaged, but here what will happen is you’ll fall so far behind on farm you’ll never be able to contribute.

The map feels too small and the pace too high, somehow, and 4 lanes seem too many. It’s been hard to feel like you can leave your lane and gank without opening too much of a vulnerability on your “home” lane. This exacerbates the problem of one lane getting stomped and that snowballing into an unstoppable victory.

It’s very possible all these problems diminish with good team play, though. This might be one of those games you can’t enjoy properly without organised team play and active voice comms.

I can see potential in the concept - needing to push and farm and take down neutrals or world bosses creates micro objectives and incentives for player movements and varied gameplay circumstances emerging from it. The shooter framing makes for a faster-paced style compared to Dota/League, and the ability and item system adds complexity and customization which increases the skill ceiling.

I think a big issue right now is balancing. The game is very snowbally and if there are catch-up mechanics in place I haven’t found them. So not losing the lanes is super important and whichever team builds a lead over the first couple of minutes tends to extend that into running the enemy team over. It also makes matchmaking and team skill gap a big problem (just like all MOBAs) since if you have a bad player they have a double negative effect: not contributing and feeding the enemies.

Apart from the aesthetic I do think the hero designs are pretty good (both in looks and gameplay) and the map has been pretty great - lots of traversal options and verticality.

I’ve had some decently fun matches today, but it’s a very uneven experience.

I’ve only had the chance to play a handful of matches but I can echo those sentiments so far, I think. Another disclaimer though is that I’ve only played random matchmaking, not any premade stacks or squads.

The resource battle sets the gameplay experience apart from stuff like Overwatch or TF2 - and not really in a good way (so far). It does get very snowbally, but if it’s intended to be a team-oriented game like Dota it’s possible I’m not seeing all the intended catch-up mechanics. It does seem like whichever team gets the best start just wins on stats, which makes the quality of matchmaking impact your fun a LOT. Uneven teams lead to very boring matches. I’ve also run into the classic Dota problem of “finish plz” - where a dominant team farms kills outside your base instead of finishing the game.

All aspects of the game are clearly alpha though - and there is potential here. Like highlighted the map is great and I think the hero designs are good (both visually and mechanically). With both four abilities and four slots for active items the game looks to be making its niche complexity and high skill ceiling - much like Dota (unsurprising given Icefrog is designing this).

I also think the MOBA aspect of pushing and farming isn’t necessarily a bad concept as it does introduce a bunch of micro-objectives which drive player movements and create emergent gameplay. It just needs better balancing I think.

Those are my thoughts as well, though I’ve only had the chance to play a couple of matches so far. When I heard about the concept it sounded cooler than it feels so far, but maybe I just need to get used to it. So far the gameplay loop hasn’t really clicked for me, and balancing the hero shooter aspects with MOBA stuff like farming and buying items hasn’t felt smooth, fluid or natural.

I do imagine - much like MOBAs - it’s more fun playing as a squad though. I’ve only done random matchmaking.

They get to sell it again.

You need to accept the friend request for me to be able to invite you to the playtest.

I think both things can be true at the same time. 30h of gameplay off a $20 game is a very reasonable proposition. At the same time, not managing to translate the procgen core mechanic into - if not infinite then - better replayability is absolutely a flaw. Some will see the procedurally generated content part and hope for something to sink hundreds of hours into, so it’s a fair warning.

Sent you a friend invite to be able to send you a playtest invite. Remember to pass it along in the chain.

Looking forward to trying it! Dota is not for everyone, but I’m excited to see what the frog is cooking. He’s a very talented game designer.

Accepted.