• DarkGamer@kbin.social
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    9
    arrow-down
    42
    ·
    edit-2
    6 months ago

    Israel has murdered at least 33,000 Palestinians, over 2/3 being civilians by their own count.

    • Collateral damage is not murder, nor are successful attacks against Hamas militants.
    • It’s interesting you cite that figure as evidence of Israel’s recklessness when it’s actually an astonishing accomplishment that they got the civilian casualty ratio so low, especially considering Hamas hides among civilians in densely populated areas. The commonly cited average in modern war is ~90% civilian casualties. This seems to be evidence that the great lengths they go to to reduce civilian casualties are paying off, not evidence they are being reckless when it comes to civilians. You’d never know it from the protesters, or comments like yours though.
    • Hamas has not surrendered nor have they been deposed. That’s when attacks would stop being self-defense.
    • SatansMaggotyCumFart@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      29
      arrow-down
      6
      ·
      6 months ago

      Are you honestly defending the murder of over 22,000 Palestinian civilians since Oct 7, 2023 as being an Israeli achievement?

      • Flying Squid@lemmy.worldM
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        19
        arrow-down
        3
        ·
        6 months ago

        They just justified bombing schools full of children above as necessary for Israel’s self-defense, so I think that’s your answer.

      • DarkGamer@kbin.social
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        8
        arrow-down
        35
        ·
        edit-2
        6 months ago

        Are you honestly ignoring the statistical evidence I provided that clearly shows it is? Were this war being waged by any other nation in the world you could expect the civilian casualties to be much higher.

              • DarkGamer@kbin.social
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                7
                arrow-down
                23
                ·
                6 months ago

                Should I just start imagining your motivations and what makes you cheer and holding it against you? Is that how we roll here?

                  • DarkGamer@kbin.social
                    link
                    fedilink
                    arrow-up
                    5
                    arrow-down
                    17
                    ·
                    edit-2
                    6 months ago
                    • A google search for this 20-1 claim yields no results. Credible citation?
                    • If they did far better than their maximum acceptable casualties, and better than the average casualties under such conditions, isn’t that a good thing that should be celebrated?
                    • Genocide, the crime, is a claim of intent and not casualty numbers. Israel says they intend to destroy Hamas, which is not a protected group under genocide statutes. Hamas says they intend to destroy Jews/Israel/Israelis, which are protected groups under genocide statutes. There is only one explicitly genocidal party in this conflict, and it’s not Israel. I support them because I oppose the genocidal.

                    Fuck you.

                    Childish insults? It’s sad you can’t respectfully disagree and support your position like an adult.

    • Bipta@kbin.social
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      16
      arrow-down
      3
      ·
      6 months ago

      Collateral damage is not murder

      This is exactly how Hamas justifies October 7th…

      • DarkGamer@kbin.social
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        2
        arrow-down
        6
        ·
        edit-2
        6 months ago

        Then they are lying. I encourage you to watch the Oct 7 attack footage, (Content warning: violence, cruelty, death,) if you have the stomach for it, which clearly disproves any such claims. This is not collateral damage. They target civilians. Full stop.

    • Flying Squid@lemmy.worldM
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      14
      arrow-down
      4
      ·
      6 months ago

      Please do explain how murdering thousands of children is self-defense against Hamas. Were they strapping suicide vests to the babies and letting them crawl over to IDF troops?

    • Silverseren@kbin.social
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      10
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      6 months ago

      Question: Is it appropriate for those civilians to get weapons and fight back against the IDF that is killing them?

      • DarkGamer@kbin.social
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        8
        arrow-down
        18
        ·
        edit-2
        6 months ago

        That’s a matter of opinion. I can understand why many Palestinians do find it appropriate, especially given the intense indoctrination that Palestinian children experience, and the lack of available unbiased credible information there.

        Given my own experience and information, I find it a lot more appropriate to fight back against Hamas, the oppressive regime that instigated this war, hides among civilians to maximize casualties, and has refused to surrender to end the war, which they could do at any time. I believe they are the primary cause of all of this death and destruction and suffering, not Israel defending itself.

        Would I feel the same way were I in their shoes? Hard to say.

        • bamboo@lemm.ee
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          15
          arrow-down
          3
          ·
          6 months ago

          You dodged the question. When the IDF is attacking and murdering Palestinians, do those Palestinians have a right to take up arms and fight back? It’s a simple yes or no question.

          • DarkGamer@kbin.social
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            5
            arrow-down
            18
            ·
            edit-2
            6 months ago

            Some questions cannot be fairly answered with a simple yes or no, like, “Have you stopped beating your wife?”

            There’s a lot of bias packed into your question. If the IDF is in fact MURDERING, as in, illegally killing people, yes they do. However, if the IDF is acting within the law they absolutely do not. Either way, I’d say it’s probably a bad move to do so and likely to get one shot.

            • Silverseren@kbin.social
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              15
              arrow-down
              3
              ·
              6 months ago

              I’m talking about right now. For example, for the people in Rafah. Do the Palestinians in Rafah have the right to fight back against the IDF that is shelling them and attacking their homes with tanks?

              • BeatTakeshi@lemmy.world
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                12
                arrow-down
                5
                ·
                6 months ago

                The real question is “are they people to you” and he’ll reply it’s not so simple

              • DarkGamer@kbin.social
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                3
                arrow-down
                16
                ·
                6 months ago

                No, that’s a legal attack on Hamas. If they take up arms they are defending Hamas as a militant.

                  • DarkGamer@kbin.social
                    link
                    fedilink
                    arrow-up
                    2
                    arrow-down
                    8
                    ·
                    edit-2
                    6 months ago

                    As if those are the only two options. Refugees in Rafah are evacuating, very few are being blown up or becoming militants.

    • tearsintherain@leminal.space
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      1
      ·
      edit-2
      6 months ago

      Can only be described as psychopathic response disguised as intellectual arguments. There aren’t enough dead babies, women and children that will move this person so long as they’re Palestinian.