This is harmful misinformation that can literally lead to people dying from tobacco related disease.
Vaping, while definitely not healthy, is NOWHERE NEAR as unhealthy as smoking tobacco is. Especially when you do it as intended: temporarily for smoking cessation like I added decades to my life by doing.
I smoked for 18 years, the last 10 of which I tried every other smoking cessation method including prescription medicine and substance abuse therapy. They just didn’t work for me.
Vaping did, though. In roughly 6 months I went from smoking a pack or two a day (depending on stress levels and alcohol intake) to neither smoking nor vaping at all and I haven’t for over 3 years.
I think the main problem is that the companies selling vapes and related products are not really targeting users who are quitting smoking. Obviously there is less money in temporary users. They are targeting people who will keep smoking, usually because it is “cool” and especially teenagers who are a good target for “cool” and can be customers for a long time.
So yes, if you are using it temporarily ease off nicotine it is great and we should keep vapes available for these people as medical devices. However we should try to reduce the damage that vapes are doing to other people. How strongly we should do this is obviously controversial. Personally I would focus on education and personal choice, but there is a strong argument to be more forceful.
If it can help people to quit smoking, I’m all for it. But I hope eventually they get to quit vaping too so they at least won’t have any of the harmfull effects of those.
If it can help people to quit smoking, I’m all for it.
That’s literally what it was invented for and 90%+ of what it’s used for today.
But I hope eventually they get to quit vaping too so they at least won’t have any of the harmfull effects of those.
Again, that’s all it was ever designed for.
That’s literally what it was invented for and 90%+ of what it’s used for today
Idk where you live, but in middle and eastern europe it’s mainly used as a cigarette replacement (especially by teenagers because they’re harder to detect)
Is that 90%+ what you feel or can you provide a profound statistic for that? Not to offend you, but that seems rather unlikely to me. This study reports about 20% of high school students using e cigarettes in 2020. It would be very suprising if these kids tried to quit smoking cigarettes
Is that 90%+ what you feel or can you provide a profound statistic for that
That 90% is admittedly going by memory of statistical analysis that I’m now unable to find amongst all the anti-vape misinformation and data that focuses only on how many vape and doesn’t show the age distribution.
Anyways, here’s some myths debunked by probably the most reliable and unbiased expert group to weigh in on vapes, the NHS.
This study reports about 20% of high school students using e cigarettes in 2020
That sounds ridiculously high. The highest I’ve seen for 2018 was 2.9%. There’s no way it went from that to 20% in just two years.
That 90% is admittedly going by memory of statistical analysis that I’m now unable to find amongst all the anti-vape misinformation and data that focuses only on how many vape and doesn’t show the age distribution.
I am not saying you are lying, I know it is impossible to memorize all studies you ever read. On the other hand this makes your 90% pretty useless, as it is not clear what is counted here. You mentioning
anti-vape misinformtionseems to me like you could be a bit biased, defending vaping for whatever reason.That sounds ridiculously high. The highest I’ve seen for 2018 was 2.9%. There’s no way it went from that to 20% in just two years.
Ok but that is not how studies work. I am not from the US, but the affiliations of the study I linked seem to be pretty credible:
Office on Smoking and Health, National Center for Chronic Disease Prevention and Health Promotion, CDC; Center for Tobacco Products, Food and Drug Administration, Silver Spring, Maryland.The “myths debunked” may be an interesting read, but it does not contribute anything useful to the discussion.
I don’t want to fight and as a non-smoker I am absolutely open to get convinced by you if you can provide some substancial information. However downvoting me is not really a strong argument.
Ridiculously low depending on the country
That’s not what it’s being used for 90% of the time. It is seen as a healthy alternative to smoking. Sadly, we cannot confirm if it’s actually healthier since there have not been a lot of long term studies yet.
Vaping has been around for nearly 15 years now and there aren’t any known harmful effects.
it’s healthier
It’s less damaging.
Less leathal.
It is healthier than cigarettes. Anyone who has smoked and vaped a lot can tell the difference in the damage that it’s causing your body. You don’t need a scientific study to tell you that not coughing for two hours every morning is better for you.
Don’t vape, but if you’re going to pick up an addictive habit pick up vaping instead of cigarettes/drinking/gacha games. Much less hazardous to your health.
How did you even get to gacha games over just gambling in general
Write what you know, I suppose.
unfortunately vaping is causing cancer which again unfortunately kill you faster than smoking
That’s literally the opposite of the truth.
Smoking tobacco is the world’s number one lifestyle cause of premature deaths in general and cancer in particular.
Meanwhile, there’s no credible evidence that vaping causes cancer at all, let alone at the extreme rate that tobacco smoking does.
Only actual study I have ever seen that even posits a reasonable way that vaping increases your risk of cancer is if you’re using shitty burnt out coils or overamping and basically inhaling atomized metals from the coil.
Basically its the equivalent of smoking a cigarette down to the filter.
It is not hard to keep your tank mostly full and swap out coils in a timely manner these days. Coil design, amount of electricity used and the juice itself have all changed to make it a lot more difficult for the burning up and inhaling your coil situation to happen.
Yeah, they torched a CE4 cartridge at over 5V for 90 seconds with no airflow.
Of course it’s going to produce harmful chemicals when it’s literally on fire.
LOL, based on which study?
Same goes for the first claim, right? Both commenters made a statement: One said it’s healthier the other said it’s causing cancer, neither has a source.
Probably because we still require quite a few more years of long term effects. We all just kinda hope it isn’t worse. In the mean time, it could make it easier to quit, though the abundance of different “flavors” has made it much harder for me to quit. Cigarettes taste bad which made it easier when I was younger to quit.
right. people has been smoking for centuries and it’s side effects has been observed and studied quite well. this new vaping thing come in different forms, size,and flavour and each cartridge does not contain only nicotine;there are harmful chemicals in there depending on how cheap it has been manufactured. all these elements work together that make vaping potentially more harmful than smoking
more time are need for the side effects of vaping to be better understood but it ain’t safer than smoking. actually there are other diseases related to vaping than the traditional smoking.here is the article https://thancguide.org/2020/08/the-journey/patients-journey/how-is-vaping-connected-to-oral-cancer/
TL;DR: That article is absolute garbage.
It only makes it through one small paragraph (which is itself a vague lie) before its first specific and ridiculous lie: claiming that a hookah is an early form of vape 🤦
It then links to a 2019 study of mice that, in spite of setting out with a clear confirmation bias, admits that their results showed more cases of cancer-like cell behavior in the mice subjected to tobacco than the ones subjected to e-liquid.
Add to that the fact that they don’t reveal their methodology (beyond the fact that they subjected the mice to their experiments for a full year, which is much longer than most people tend to vape when using it for smoking cessation) and that study is basically useless for proving the hypothesis.
The heavy metals inhalation they then go on to warn about is impossible in real life conditions as the heat required for that to happen simply cannot be achieved by the suction power any human can achieve and, even if you could somehow achieve that, you’d suffer severe burns causing you to stop immediately.
I mean, hookah was an early form of vaping. You use coals to indirectly heat tobacco to vaporize the nicotine and flavor carrier.
Everything else is accurate, though.
I’m 100% with you on the health stuff, but out of genuine curiosity:
its first specific and ridiculous lie: claiming that a hookah is an early form of vape
It is, though? You might think of an e-cig when you hear “vape” but it’s short for “vaporization” or “vaporizer”, which are actually different from smoking.
In smoking you light the material itself on fire and draw the smoke produced by the active incineration of the material into your lungs.
In vaping you heat the air around a substance (even loose plant material) and cause the actual material to vaprize, not incinerate, and you inhale that vapor, not smoke.
The key differences being a lack of tar and similar gunk from the actual flame, despite seeming like a mere semantic difference there are actual physical differences.
It’s been a while since I saw a hookah in action, but my understanding is that they heat up the air with charcoal and that you then draw that past the tobacco and through water before it goes into your lungs. That’s the exact same thing my Ditanium desktop vaporizer does, except it uses a quartz heater and not charcoal. The plant matter itself doesn’t burn, so no tar. Maybe some from the charcoal, but even then the claim that it’s an early version of what is today called vaping is probably a fair assessment.
The funny thing is that vapes don’t actually vaporize; they atomize.
Good lookin’ all around except I’d dispute this claim:
(beyond the fact that they subjected the mice to their experiments for a full year, which is much longer than most people tend to vape when using it for smoking cessation)
Fuck off, tobacco troll.
I mean I switched to vaping a few years back. Still getting a smokers cough and breathing has barely improved. I should quit completely. Vaping has made it slightly easier, though. But in all honesty, screw the health effects of either I’m just glad I don’t reek of cigarettes anymore. I didn’t realize how absolutely awful my clothes smelt until I switched.
I switched to snus. I’m also so happy about the smell. Congrats us for quitting cigarettes
When I first hugged my little brother after I switched to vaping he said, “you don’t smell like cigarettes” and my heart just broke. I can’t ever go back, even if vaping isn’t really helping me quit nicotine, it’s still saving them from being around the smell like I was when I was a little kid, and I hated that damn smell. Should’ve never started, but it’s easier said than done.
Not starting isn’t hard at all though.
So, ok, absolutely if you go through disposable vape after disposable vape, yes you are literally throwing batteries away…
But if you get a rechargeable, refillable pocket vape, which you can get for maybe the cost of two or three disposables…
Then you are just recharging a battery. Usually a much smaller (in terms of energy capacity) battery than even the crappiest phone.
Obviously you should not pick up vaping as a habit, but it is faaaar less bad for you than smoking, and if you were already addicted to smoking, well switching to a vape is healthier and less expensive.
Myself I spent almost a decade smoking, switched to a vape and my lung capacity is greatly improved, oral health is way better, oh and no more horrific coughing. I am slowly dialing down the concentration in the hopes that one day I’ll be able to quit.
Before that it was years of trying to quit cigarettes, making it a week or a month with none, giving up and getting a pack, feeling like a piece of shit figuratively and literally as they’d make me sick again.
People do not seem to widely realize or appreciate that nicotine withdrawals are as bad or worse than heroin withdrawals.
Another hand grenade you can throw into this is: Sure, smoking weed has varying medicinal properties, but it also has the problem that you are smoking something.
Do you smoke your blunts through a filter?
No?
Oh, ok so thats about the same tar and particulate matter as the same amount of smoking hand rolled cigarettes.
Ive known plenty of habitual weed smokers with the traditionally tobacco associated ‘smokers cough’, and they would tell me that smoking MJ is actually healthy for you as they are weezing and out of breath, hacking up a lung after a flight or two of stairs.
The coughing, holy shit. I used to wake up and sound like I was dying and spit out so much nasty shit every morning. My family could literally tell when I was awake by the sounds I made.
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Thanks!
And no, I have not heard about that, do you have a link to something going into that maybe?
If you do I will read it after I wake up, I have been up all night and just wrote a couple hundred words of a short story about Elon Musk being the world’s worst sandwich maker.
Delirium is clearly upon me so I should probably sleep now.
I’ll have a look at it in the morning. I can’t seem to find much usefull by doing a little google search. I know I’ve seen it on tv and it wasn’t some kind of fever dream. Seems it has to do with the soft tissue.
I’ve head some doctors say it can cause cancer in the soft tissue indide your mouth and cheeks.
[Edit] Why the hell am I being downvoted? This is confirmed information.
From the link:
“It’s not only tobacco smoking that can affect oral health and have other health risks. When vape juice is heated it can potentially damage enamel and irritate soft tissue. As the ingredients tend to be thick and sticky, vapers may be at a higher risk of developing tooth decay and gum disease,” Dr Brown said.
That is a far cry from cancer, which your link makes no mention of.
It also says:
The oral health risks of dry mouth are compounded if people consume sweetened drinks, such as flavoured milks, energy drinks and soft drinks instead of water to combat the effects, which can then provide a greater food source for bacteria.”
So if this is what you’re hanging your hat on you better fucking only drink water my dude.
Because I’ve watched doctors say it on tv but finding similar articles is harder because you get spammed with other articles you’re not looking for.
But I guess everyone likes to downvote when they don’t like the content because that was before I even shared that link.
Mmhmm.
Source?
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Healthier than cigarettes is such a low bar to clear that it doesn’t really mean much.
They’re 95% safer, so they cleared it by quite a lot
May I have a souce on that 95% safer, please?
95% has been cited for 9 years, constantly, and the study is available from a simple google search, along with many articles since then that muddy the water.
The truth will continue to be of the same spirit, though, and rather obviously: vaping is substantially less harmful than smoking.
Thank you, it was a simple ask, but you still haven’t provided a source on the 95%. I understand that vaping is less harmful than cigarettes, but you put up the 95%, I shouldn’t have to look up your claim.
you put up the 95%
No, I’m not the person you responded to.
But “I shouldn’t have to look up your claim” is really letting yourself down. Be better. You weren’t forced to look something up, you were elucidated to the fact that it was an oft-cited, elementary component of the vaping discussion, and that if you were ignorant to the concept, it was but a google search away.
Instead of educating yourself, you did the thing petulant internet trolls do and told us you felt entitled to spoon-fed basics. I don’t think you are trolling, so do yourself a favor next time and take responsibility for your ignorance, and pleasure in finding out new things for yourself. Then you won’t have to feel called out for being too lazy to learn, just too lazy to look at usernames.
I’m sorry it was late, I was falling asleep and didn’t realize you were someone else.
And instead of 1/2 a pack a day, people who vape only do it for 14h/day
And?
Unfortunately, it also means that boomers who smoke cigarettes won’t ever try vaping because “they’re both bad for your health”.
I have this vape and i just reload it like a sawn off shotgunMan… You’re living in 2050, and I just keep 3 extra batteries in my pocket. What vape is that?
Istick tria, bought in 2018 and enjoyed ever since
What movie is this from?
I wanna know too, it looks cool
Most important question here
My only problem with people that vape is they think they can do it where you can’t smoke a cigarette and/or joint. Sorry bro, get over here with the rest of us, no one wants to smell your shitty strawberry flavored whatever.
If a vape didn’t have a scent though, would it still be forbidden?
A lot of comments here are saying that vaping is apprently healthier than smoking. But we don’t actually know that. All independent studies I know of say that we can’t tell the long term consequences to vaping lungs yet.
Everyone that says that vaping is healthier than smoking is just parotting the companies that sell vapes.
Edit: Some videos about that topic:
we don’t know the long term consequences
Does not equate to “just as harmful as cigarettes”. All of the data that we have available shows it to be considerably less harmful than cigarettes. If there are long term consequences, and there almost certainly are, they will still be less harmful than cigarettes.
I never said that vapes are “just as harmful as cigaretres”. Altough most studies that suggest “less harmful” vapes are corporately sponsored by vape companies and tobacco companies that are slowly adopting vapes into their model.
Vapes as a tool to quit smoking are a nice tale, and probably work sometimes. But mostly vapes attracted teenagers and young adults and have started addicting a new generation of smokers/vapers after numbers have been falling these past few years.
Vapes as a tool to quit smoking are a nice tale, and probably work sometimes.
Vapes as a smoking cessation method has a 70% success rate. The next closest method is less than 3%.
So who’s paying you to shill?
We’re not parroting companies selling vapes. This is literally 9 years ago: https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/e-cigarettes-an-evidence-update
At least 95% less harmful than tobacco.
9 years of evidence is a lot of time when it comes to signs of long term damage. Especially with a new technology
Yup. They have updated studies, as late as last year, without much change in the outcome. People have been vaping for 13-14 years now too.
My point being, we have studies its less unhealthy by a huge degree, and it’s also backed up by anecdotal evidence.
Whatever the case, if you are a smoker, you definitely will live longer if you switch to vaping.
How much longer compared to no smoking/vaping remains to be seen in long term.
Anecdotally: just about every smoker I know has had the effects of smoking related problems go away just after few months of vaping. No wheezing, smokers cough going away, respitory issues and sleep apnea either reduced or gone.
Ok, fair, but you’re missing the blatantly obvious here:
Even if at 20 years you suddenly drop dead of vaper’s lung, those first 19.99 years were significantly less unhealthy than smoking cigarettes was.
So, the longer we go without seeing long-term issues, the more extreme those issues would need to be to actually outweigh cigarette danger.
List the chemicals in a vape and then list the chemicals in a cigarette and tell me that vaping isnt a healthier alternative to smoking.
“It’s fine, probably…”
-someone making money off it
Actually, it was on the Dutch news recently that doctors find that it’s really unhealthy for teenagers.
People shouldn’t be under the impression it’s healthy, it’s just a lot less unhealthy than cigarettes.
to be fair it is, especially in the quantities you would need that huge power bank for
Check out this comprehensive review from 2022 about vaping and health:
https://doi.org/10.1136/bmj-2021-065997The last bit in its conclusion section states:
“The true impact of vaping on respiratory health will manifest over the coming decades, but in the interval a prudent and time tested recommendation remains to abstain from consumption of inhaled nicotine and other products.”The best is don’t smoke at all
Vaping isn’t smoking. It’s a smoking cessation method that involves no smoke or burning and contains no tobacco.
